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	<title>(b)logophile &#187; greek</title>
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	<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog</link>
	<description>blog of a logophile (not "logos", but "λόγος")</description>
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		<title>Steps in Greek</title>
		<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2009/11/07/steps-in-greek/</link>
		<comments>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2009/11/07/steps-in-greek/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 18:49:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>tikitu</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[amusement]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[embarassment]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[greek]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logophile.org/blog/?p=777</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[At the restaurant the other night, I had a genuine spontaneous conversation in Greek. It went like this (while I was sitting with some folks playing music):

Μια κοπέλα με ρώτησε κάτι που δεν κατάλαβα. Είπα, &#8220;Δεν είμαι Έλληνας.&#8221; Είπε αυτή, &#8220;Δεν είσαι Έλληνας και παίζεις μπαγλαμά;&#8221; Εγώ: &#8220;Δεν είναι μπαγλαμάς! Τζουράς είναι!&#8221; Είπε &#8220;Συγνώμη&#8221;&#8230; και [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At the restaurant the other night, I had a genuine spontaneous conversation in Greek. It went like this (while I was sitting with some folks playing music):</p>

<p>Μια κοπέλα με ρώτησε κάτι που δεν κατάλαβα. Είπα, &#8220;Δεν είμαι Έλληνας.&#8221; Είπε αυτή, &#8220;Δεν είσαι Έλληνας και παίζεις μπαγλαμά;&#8221; Εγώ: &#8220;Δεν είναι μπαγλαμάς! Τζουράς είναι!&#8221; Είπε &#8220;Συγνώμη&#8221;&#8230; και έφυγε.</p>

<p>That is: A girl asked me something which I didn&#8217;t understand. I said, &#8220;I&#8217;m not Greek.&#8221; She said, &#8220;You&#8217;re not Greek and you play baglamas?&#8221; Me: &#8220;It&#8217;s not a bagmalas! It&#8217;s a tzouras!&#8221; She said &#8220;Sorry&#8221;&#8230; and left.</p>

<p>It&#8217;s a conversation, of a sort, right?</p>

<p>[Any correct spelling in the Greek portion of this post was made possible by the kind intervention of Olga.]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<slash:comments>0</slash:comments>
		</item>
		<item>
		<title>I dream Greek!</title>
		<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/10/17/i-dream-greek/</link>
		<comments>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/10/17/i-dream-greek/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 09:20:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>tikitu</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[dreams]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[greek]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logophile.org/blog/?p=476</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[They reckon that dreaming in a second language is a big milestone. This morning my alarm clock rang at 7:45. I reset it for 8 and went back to sleep, to dream a voice saying with great surprise &#8220;Στις οχτώ;&#8221; (At eight?), and myself replying &#8220;Στις οχτώ.&#8221;

Could have just been Olga objecting I suppose.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They reckon that dreaming in a second language is a big milestone. This morning my alarm clock rang at 7:45. I reset it for 8 and went back to sleep, to dream a voice saying with great surprise &#8220;Στις <em>οχτώ</em>;&#8221; (At <em>eight</em>?), and myself replying &#8220;Στις οχτώ.&#8221;</p>

<p>Could have just been Olga objecting I suppose.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<slash:comments>0</slash:comments>
		</item>
		<item>
		<title>Gree/i/ie/k is tri/ee/ie/cky</title>
		<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/10/01/greeiiek-is-trieeiecky/</link>
		<comments>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/10/01/greeiiek-is-trieeiecky/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Oct 2008 09:29:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>tikitu</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[bemusement]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[greek]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logophile.org/blog/?p=466</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Greek spelling is both wonderful and awful.

It&#8217;s wonderful because, completely unlike English, if you see a word written down you know exactly how to pronounce it. It&#8217;s awful because knowing how to pronounce a word still leaves you lots of options for how to spell it.

Today&#8217;s discovery is the verb &#8220;to use&#8221;: χρησιμοποιώ. Third person [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greek spelling is both wonderful and awful.</p>

<p>It&#8217;s wonderful because, <a href="http://www.futilitycloset.com/2008/08/27/spelling-peril/">completely unlike English</a>, if you see a word written down you know exactly how to pronounce it. It&#8217;s awful because knowing how to pronounce a word still leaves you lots of options for how to spell it.</p>

<p>Today&#8217;s discovery is the verb &#8220;to use&#8221;: χρησιμοποιώ. Third person singular (present) that&#8217;s χρησιμοποιεί, which has the distinction of containing almost all the ways to spell /i/ (the vowel of English &#8220;street&#8221;): η, ι, οι, and ει. It&#8217;s only missing υ, and yes folks, that means there are <em>five ways</em> to spell that one sound.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<slash:comments>13</slash:comments>
		</item>
		<item>
		<title>Bank is tricky</title>
		<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/09/22/bank-is-tricky/</link>
		<comments>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/09/22/bank-is-tricky/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 13:30:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>tikitu</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[bemusement]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[greek]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logophile.org/blog/?p=462</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[English: I keep my money in a &#8220;bank&#8221;; A river has &#8220;banks&#8221;. Not the same.

Dutch: I keep my money in a &#8220;bank&#8221;; You sit on a &#8220;bank&#8221; to watch tv (couch). Not the same.

Greek: I (could, if I were in Greece) keep my money in a &#8220;τράπεζα&#8221;. You eat dinner at the &#8220;τραπέζι&#8221; (table). Not [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>English: I keep my money in a &#8220;bank&#8221;; A river has &#8220;banks&#8221;. Not the same.</p>

<p>Dutch: I keep my money in a &#8220;bank&#8221;; You sit on a &#8220;bank&#8221; to watch tv (couch). Not the same.</p>

<p>Greek: I (could, if I were in Greece) keep my money in a &#8220;τράπεζα&#8221;. You eat dinner at the &#8220;τραπέζι&#8221; (table). Not the same.</p>

<p>(Yes, the last one isn&#8217;t actually lexical ambiguity. So sue me. Also, Micha tells me that German has the first three: financial institution, ground abutting a river, and bench. Whee!)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<slash:comments>1</slash:comments>
		</item>
		<item>
		<title>Spain is tricky</title>
		<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/09/18/spain-is-tricky/</link>
		<comments>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2008/09/18/spain-is-tricky/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Sep 2008 13:07:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>tikitu</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[bemusement]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[greek]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logophile.org/blog/?p=450</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#8217;ve got some kind of bizarro mental block going on with &#8220;Spain&#8221; in Greek. I confuse it with Israel and Japan.

There are reasons, but they&#8217;re kind complicated. First off, it&#8217;s pronounced roughly &#8220;IspanEEa&#8221;, which I visualise as &#8220;Ispania&#8221; (yup, visualising the Greek sounds in Latin letters, you can see where this is going to go [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve got some kind of bizarro mental block going on with &#8220;Spain&#8221; in Greek. I confuse it with Israel and Japan.</p>

<p>There are reasons, but they&#8217;re kind complicated. First off, it&#8217;s pronounced roughly &#8220;IspanEEa&#8221;, which I visualise as &#8220;Ispania&#8221; (yup, visualising the Greek sounds in Latin letters, you can see where this is going to go wrong). And if I haven&#8217;t had my morning coffee, Ισραήλ just looks too similar. Getting to Japan depends on two additional little problems: I have trouble remembering that it&#8217;s spelled with omega instead of omicron, and the font our textbook uses makes sigma, omicron and alpha all look really similar, especially before pi. So I can see Ισπανία and read Ιαπονία which really should be Ιαπωνία.</p>

<p>Also I, like several of my classmates, have a tendency to read ρολόι (roloi, watch or clock) as poli (very), or on a bad day when my accent slips, pouli (πουλί? however it&#8217;s spelled, it makes everyone laugh). &#8220;Πόσο κάνει τον πουλί σου, Παυλο;&#8221;</p>

<p><font size="-1">(Whatever was wrong with Firefox and Greek input seems to have fixed itself. Maybe it was the KDE updates the other day?)</font></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		</item>
		<item>
		<title>First steps with Greek</title>
		<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2007/09/27/first-steps-with-greek/</link>
		<comments>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2007/09/27/first-steps-with-greek/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Sep 2007 21:55:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>tikitu</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[greek]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[language(s)]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[nacissism]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logophile.org/blog/?p=349</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#8217;ve started learning (modern) Greek, and I caught my first sentence in the wild this weekend. It was &#8220;I want a (cup of) tea&#8221; (θέλω ένα τσάι).

What&#8217;s that to be excited about, and what is &#8220;in the wild&#8221;? Well, it means it was


spoken by someone I don&#8217;t know well,
in a context where many different sentences [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve started learning (modern) Greek, and I caught my first sentence in the wild this weekend. It was &#8220;I want a (cup of) tea&#8221; (θέλω ένα τσάι).</p>

<p>What&#8217;s that to be excited about, and what is &#8220;in the wild&#8221;? Well, it means it was</p>

<ul>
<li>spoken by someone I don&#8217;t know well,</li>
<li>in a context where many different sentences could have been expected, and</li>
<li>understood compositionally, word-by-word, not by pattern matching on things I recognise.</li>
</ul>

<p>Which means it&#8217;s happening! Rock it with the language faculty!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<slash:comments>0</slash:comments>
		</item>
		<item>
		<title>Six degrees of baglama</title>
		<link>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2007/09/01/six-degrees-of-baglama/</link>
		<comments>http://www.logophile.org/blog/2007/09/01/six-degrees-of-baglama/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Sep 2007 13:46:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>tikitu</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[dutch]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[greek]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[music]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logophile.org/blog/?p=337</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I had a close encounter with rockstardom last night. A bloke from De Dijk (keyboardist, according to Nikos) was at Dionysos where I went for an after-dinner dinner, and it turns out he plays baglama and bouzouki also. Hellenophiles get everywhere, it seems&#8230;
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had a close encounter with rockstardom last night. A bloke from <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Dijk">De Dijk</a> (keyboardist, according to Nikos) was at <a href="http://www.dionysos-taverna.nl/">Dionysos</a> where I went for an after-dinner dinner, and it turns out he plays baglama and bouzouki also. Hellenophiles get everywhere, it seems&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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